Vatican Says U.n. Goes Too Far in Devastating Report
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A new United Nations report is bluntly critical of the Vatican, saying it has adopted polices that allowed priest to rape and molest tens of thousands of children over decades. The widely anticipated report from the U.N. Committee on the Rights of the Child goes on to say that the Vatican is guilty of a “code of silence” that has “systematically” put the reputation of the church and offending priests over the protection of child victims. The Vatican says the report goes too far when it also includes criticism of the church’s teaching on conception and birth control, human sexuality and abortion. That report comes as a Catholic-affiliated publisher in Poland issues a controversial book of Pope John Paul II’s notes. Vatican expert and journalist John Allen joins Here & Now’s Robin Young to discuss both the U.N. report and the book. Interview Highlights: John Allen On reaction to the U.N. report “I suspect reaction to it — both at the Vatican and in the wider Catholic world — is going to be mixed, because the cause of child protection here is bundled, as you indicated, with the culture wars. It also is basically telling the Vatican they need to repeal Catholic teaching on abortion, birth control and gay marriage. You know, my reaction to that as a journalist is, ‘how to you spell non-starter.’ You know, those things are just not going to happen. And I suspect there will be some backlash that will want to style this report somehow as driven more by politics than a real concern for the protection of kids.” On the impact of the U.N. report “The child sexual abuse scandals in Catholicism are real, the need for reform is real. There still is a division in the church between reformers and those who are kind of in denial, and that’s true at the grassroots, it’s true of the leadership. This report was an opportunity to strengthen the hand of the reform cause by making very specific recommendations that would be hard to argue with. And the fear would be that by bundling this with the very divisive matters of the culture wars, you’ve given ammunition to those in denial, to say ‘eh, this is all politics.’” On what happens when bishops don’t report abuse “The Vatican does have policies that say that if you get a credible accusation of abuse — you’re a bishop — you’ve got to act on it. Now there are cases in which bishops haven’t. I mean, we have a bishop in the Diocese of Kansas City in the United States, for example, who pled guilty to a criminal charge of failure to report and is still sitting there as the bishop of Kansas City. So the question is, what are the consequences for that kind of breakdown. What the U.N. panel said is, there have to be consequences and this new commission ought to lead the charge to create them. I think that’s something that even people within the church — certainly the reform wing of the church — would say is not only reasonable but urgently necessary.” Guest
Study Shows Record Number Of Criminal Exonerations February 4, 2014 close Transcript ROBIN YOUNG, HOST: It's HERE AND NOW. And now, another story maybe not for children. The Vatican is responding to today's much-anticipated report from the U.N. Committee on the Rights of the Child. Church officials testified before the committee a month ago. Today's report bluntly criticized the Catholic hierarchy for policies that allow priests to rape and molest tens of thousands of children over decades. And the report also dipped into the culture wars, criticizing church teachings on abortion, homosexuality and contraception. Until the report today, the headlines had been about that book of John Paul II's personal notes, published even though he asked in his will that they be burned. John Allen is a longtime Vatican correspondent who's just joined the Boston Globe. So, John, welcome to our studios. JOHN ALLEN: It's a pleasure to be here. YOUNG: And a pleasure to speak with you, although this is, I'm sure, a tough day in the Catholic world. Your take on this U.N. report. ALLEN: Well, it certainly is a damning indictment of the way the broader church and the Vatican in particular has responded to the child sexual abuse scandals that had been such a cancer in Catholic life for the better part of the last decade. You quoted from the report accurately. It says the Vatican imposed policies and procedures that allowed this abuse to go on. And in further, they alleged the Vatican created a culture of impunity for the perpetrators of this abuse. They suggest that there was a widespread practice of moving these abusers around, rather than engaging the problem, which they allege, in some cases, continues. So it's a dramatic call to reform. Now, that said, I suspect the reaction to it - both in the Vatican and in the wider Catholic world - is going to be a little bit mixed, because the cause of child protection here was bundled, as you indicated, with the culture wars. It also basically is telling the Vatican they need to repeal Catholic teaching on abortion, birth control and gay marriage. You know, my reaction to that as a journalist is: How do you spell non-starter? You know, those things just aren't going to happen. And I suspect there will be some backlash that will want to style this report somehow as driven more by politics than a real concern with the protection of kids. YOUNG: Well, the Vatican has responded to that. They've been more muted on the response to the criticism of how they handled the sex abuse scandal. But they have responded to that portion of the report, saying that it interferes with religious freedom. Why do you think the U.N. did wander into this area? They were talking about the health and safety of children. Are they tying that to, you know, maybe not the act of abortion, but education about abortion? I mean, how are they tying these two things together? ALLEN: Well, this is the Committee for the Rights of the Child. So, for example, on the gay marriage issue, they raised this in the context of concern that children of same-sex couples may be discriminated against because of the sexual orientation of their parents. And so... YOUNG: By - discriminated against by the Catholic Church. ALLEN: Well, being discriminated against by anyone, and is the church doing enough to defend them. So there is a kind of linkage with the cause of child protection. But at the end of the day, you know, my concern here would be that the child sexual abuse scandals in Catholicism are real. The need for reform is real. There still is a division in the church between reformers and those who were kind of in denial. And that's true with the grassroots. It's true of the leadership. This report was an opportunity to strengthen the hand of the reform cause by making very specific recommendations that would be hard to argue with. And the fear would be that by bundling this with the very divisive matters of the culture wars, you've given ammunition to those in denial to say, you know, this is all politics. YOUNG: And, by the way, what were some of the specific recommendations of the report? ALLEN: Well, one, Francis decided in December to create a new papal commission on child protection to kind of lead the fight for reform. The committee recommended that this commission not only investigate abuse claims, but also investigate instances where bishops drop the ball. That is - the church says it's got a tough zero-tolerance policy. But the question is: What are the consequences if an individual bishop doesn't follow it? And to date, that's been an impossible question to answer. YOUNG: Well, in fact, the hearings in which Vatican church officials went before this committee to testify a month ago, they pretty much said that their thinking was they don't have control over the rest of the church. It sounds like, in this report, the U.N. is saying, if you don't, you should. ALLEN: Well, I think these are different questions. What the Vatican said in Geneva is that it is not the direct supervisor of the more than 400,000 Catholic priests in the world. That's the job of the local bishop. And that remains true. But the point is, the Vatican does have policies that say that if you get a credible accusation of abuse, you're a bishop, you've got to act on it. Now, there are cases in which bishops haven't. I mean, we have a bishop in the Diocese of Kansas City in the United States, for example, who pled guilty to a criminal charge of failure to report, and is still sitting there as the bishop at Kansas City. So the question is: What are the consequences for that kind of break down? What the U.N. panel said is there have to be consequences, and this new commission ought to lead the charge, create them. I think that's something that even people within the church, certainly the reform wing of the church, would say is not only reasonable, it's urgently necessary. YOUNG: Well, John Allen, we thought when we originally asked you to come in that we were going to spend all this time talking about the other controversy, the book that's been published by a Catholic-affiliated publisher, a new book of Pope John Paul II's personal notes. It's called "I'm Very Much In God's Hands." He explicitly said in his will he wanted these papers burned. And a cardinal who was his associate decided to publish them. Do we know what's in them? ALLEN: Yes, because the book has been published. It's, unfortunately, available right now only in Polish. YOUNG: Polish, right. ALLEN: But, you know, you can bet your bottom dollar, given all the John Paul II fan base that's still out there, that it'll be appearing in other languages soon. It's a 600-plus page set of largely spiritual meditations. This is kind of a prayer diary that Karol Wojtyla, the man who became John Paul II, kept. It goes all the way back to the 1960s and then follows him through his papacy. There's no sensational new revelation. I mean, nothing about a girlfriend he had before he entered the priesthood or anything like that. But it will certainly be of interest to people who have a lively devotion to John Paul who, of course, is going to be declared a saint of the Catholic Church on April 27. It's a window into his spiritual life. YOUNG: Well, what do you think, though, about the huge controversy over whether or not it should have been published? He gave it to this trusted friend. Some are saying that maybe there was sort of a winking kind of, you know, I'm saying in my will don't publish it, but maybe you should. I mean, what about the controversy over whether it should be published? ALLEN: Well, the guy we're talking about, Cardinal Stanislaw Dziwisz, was John Paul's right-hand man when he was the archbishop of Krakow. He was his right-hand man for the almost 27 years he was pope. I mean, Dziwisz is the closest thing to a son that Karol Wojtyla ever had. So I think if there's anyone on Earth you kind of basically ought to trust to know what John Paul really wanted, I would suspect that it's Dziwisz. Plus, you got to understand that Dziwisz has this kind of loving son's attitude towards the pope thinking, you know, he may have wanted this thing burned, but this is just way too precious and way too important to let it go. And I'm sure there was a huge corner of his heart that just couldn't do it. YOUNG: That's John Allen, longtime Vatican correspondent who has just joined the Boston Globe, weighing in on a lot going on in the church today. ALLEN: All things Catholic. YOUNG: Thank you so much, John. ALLEN: You're welcome. YOUNG: And there's lots of conversation on the U.N. report at facebook.com/hereandnowradio. You can join in there, or leave a comment with this story at hereandnow.org. Love to hear from you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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